Debates of Prophet Muhammad (S) with scholars of five different religions/ part 3
Part 3: Debate with Atheists
The Prophet (S) then turned towards the atheists and said: “Now, tell me what is the reason behind your claim that the objects [or whatever is] in this Universe have no beginning and they have been there forever and will exist forever.”
The atheists replied: ‘We are simply stating what we observe. We have not seen hudooth [contingency, coming into existence] in objects [or whatever exists] of the Universe so we say that this Universe has been there forever and when we did not observe destruction and annihilation, we postulated that whatever exists in this Universe is not transient [will never annihilate].’
The Prophet (S) said: “Did you find this Universe qadeem [eternally pre-existent, without a beginning] or did you find it eternal? If you say so, then explain if you yourself are in the same physical and intellectual state as you are now and that you will remain like this forever. If you will answer positively, then undoubtedly, you will deny your own observation and reject the observation of the observers [in other words, you yourself were not in the same physical and intellectual state].”
Facing this question from the Prophet (S), the atheists replied: ‘No, we do not find this Universe pre-existent or everlasting.’
The Prophet (S) then said: “Then how come you said that the objects in this Universe are eternally pre-existent and eternal? And when you did not observe hudooth [contingency, coming into being] or inqadha6 (perishing, being transient) in this Universe, you called it pre-existent and eternal; while it was better for you, when you did not find eternal pre-existence and eternity in this Universe, to claim that this Universe is haadith [came into existence] and has inqadha (perishable). Alright, have you seen how the day and night come one after another?”
The atheists said: ‘Yes.’
The Prophet (S) said: “Do you think of the night and the day to be eternal?”
The atheists said: ‘Yes.’
The Prophet (S) said: “In your opinion, can the night and the day coexist?”
The atheists said: ‘No.’
The Prophet (S) continued: “Doesn’t one of them separate from the other and come forward and the other one follow it?”
The atheists said: ‘Yes, this is how it works.’
The Prophet (S) said: “So, through your affirmation, you have said that the night and the day that have passed display hudooth [coming into existence], while you have not observed it directly. Now, tell me you say that the Universe is eternally pre-existent and not haadith [something pre-existent]. Do you know what are the things that you will have to admit to and reject, based on your proposition?”
The atheists said: ‘Yes.’
The Prophet (S) said: “You have definitely observed that in this Universe, one thing is dependent over another because existence of anything in this Universe is impossible without its contact [or connection] with another thing. You may have seen how some parts of a building are dependent over others or else, the building would be unstable and not be able to stand as a unit [will fall] and this is true for everything [in this Universe]. The same is true for all other objects. So, when these objects, while being eternally pre-existent, require other objects for their strength and completeness, so now tell me, what would have been their situation and characteristics had they been haadith [having a beginning]?”
Imam Ali (as) says that after hearing this question from Prophet Muhammad (S), all the atheists were baffled and understood that it is impossible to acquire a new characteristic for a haadith object [something with a beginning] that is different from the characteristics of the objects which we call qadeem (eternally pre-existent).
The atheists stopped their discussion and said: ‘We wish to think over our matters for some time…’
